Male Dominance? Really?
Which dominates the other?
I wrote this back in May of this year for UCI’s New University in response to a pretty bigoted/feminist-to-the-point-of-sexist article:
Since we had a woman-biased article on “male domination” in last week’s New University [“The Problem with Iron Men,” May 19, 2008”] I thought I should offer an alternative perspective. The article one-sidedly claimed that men in general sexualize and objectify women. The article made it seem like “white males” have all the power, and I could not disagree more. Women’s suffrage has come a long way from the sexist ideas of the past. And yes, it’s awful that there are still some men who rape, beat, oppress and objectify women. Thankfully, those men are not the majority. Nobody likes those guys.
What about this so-called “male dominance”? Guys, when was the last time you went to a club and had 10 or 15 girls start dancing with you or hitting on you without you even instigating it? Zero. How many times has a girl asked you out? Probably none. How often has a girl made the first move on you? Rarely. Do you pay for her dinner? Damn straight you do because you come off as tacky if you don’t. Face it: We’re all whipped by a woman before we even shake her hand.
Do guys talk about how hot women are? Of course we do, and women do the same thing to men. Men have Jessica Alba, and women have Johnny Depp. To say that men “objectify” and “sexualize” women without acknowledging that women are also sexual beings is ridiculous. Men worry just as much as women about how attractive they are; why do you think the weight room at the ARC is always full? Looking sexually attractive is a societal expectation shared by both sexes.
Ah, but what about the strippers and porn stars alluded to in last week’s article? Men objectify them, but it’s their job to be objectified, just like it’s the job of male strippers and male porn stars to be objectified. Last week’s article said, “When women strip for men, they put themselves in vulnerable positions where men can fantasize about penetrating their bodies. When men strip for women, it is the exact opposite. … They strut their ‘stuff’ and show how powerful and strong they are.” With all respect to strippers, this isn’t true. As a group, strippers strip to serve as eye candy for their audience. It’s what they’re paid to do and why people go to see them, whether they’re male or female.
Another surprising line from last week’s article said, “Why are we surprised when we hear about school shootings, domestic abuse and rape? … These problems are not problems with our kids, and they are not cases of insanity. They are men’s problems.” If that’s not sexist, then I don’t know what is. Both men and women are capable of committing the same atrocities. Attributing certain actions – such as violence – to a single group of people is bigoted.
I believe that women still face many struggles, such as abusive boyfriends and sexist employers. But to list societal expectations as a method of “male dominance” over women is simply illegitimate. Men also have to deal with society’s expectations. We come up and dance with you at clubs, hit on you at bars, risk rejection, plan first dates, make first moves and decide when to propose. I’ve met women who say, “I don’t like to make the first move.” I’ve even been turned down from a job at the University Center simply because, in the words of a disgruntled-looking female employee, “They’re only hiring women at the moment.” And of course, it’s a social custom for men to ask a girl’s permission to date her or marry her.
Therefore, I reject the claim that female models, female strippers, female anything are immorally sexualized and objectified. As long as male models and strippers are considered sexually appealing, objectification isn’t immoral. I won’t deny that the playing field isn’t level for women in many aspects of society. Hundreds of years of actual male dominance are not going to level out just like that. But beneath the professional part of society lies the social aspect, like going to clubs, bars and parties and even flirting with someone in a restaurant. The female gender controls these situations, while men have to work for it. To say that men as a gender dominate the party scene, the clubbing scene or the bar scene is asinine. Chris Rock once eloquently summed it up: “Women are offered dick every day. … Nobody offers us s**t.”
By ~Tinct
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Tinct, to address only one of your many fallacious statements, I would like point out that saying male and female strippers and porn stars are both just “eye candy” does not actually repudiate the fact that for a woman to be “eye candy” she is supposed to be seen as vulnerable and for a man to be “eye candy” he is supposed to be seen as strong. We see this all the time in all different types of media. What makes women “attractive” is their helplessness, subservience, and demureness, whereas for a man to be “attractive” he must show strength, power and intelligence. I think this is something you should address in your argument, rather than trying to take an easy way out. Currently you are operating under the fallacy of false equivalence.
Why can’t you write the word “sexualize”? Why do you use an asterisk in place of the “e”? Since when is “sex” a dirty word?
So what you’re saying is that it is ok for the males feelings to be harmed because the female has no manners, you also say that females should not have to take this risk because of some excuse that essentially seems to be, I want equall rights, but only the rights that I want to be equal on. That is hypocritical. Note, you are absolutely correct, I have had my feelings hurt, but that was due to bad manners, not due to biase(if you fail to comprehend that then you are clearly missing the point)
You say that the girl is taking a risk, yes that is true, but it is the same risk as the boy, once she has accepted the date, niether of them can possibly know how the other is going to interact with the other on the date)that is why I pointed out the extra risk that the male undergoes by having to be the one to ask.
You say that the guy analyses the girl for a long time yet the girl doesn’t, that is so false it is laughable, most males and females have known each other for a long time(unless it’s a pickup in a bar or whatever) in which case they usually know things about each other(unless of course the male/female in question is a stalker or something. You also say they take their own time to ask, often times they are trying to decide whether the girl would be interested or not and then take the risk, whereas a girl does not,(you’re right about not having extra time or fill in forms “how witty”) however she can say no politely or say yes(the risk), or say she’ll think about it(this can lead to either an eventual yes or no), or she can decide to converse with him so as to better get to know him(this again can lead either to a yes or no).
You say it’s an opinion, fair enough, but on here your opinion can be agreed with or not, you kicked off your comment with it all being childish thereby showing your lack of thought on the matter, as you can see in other comments a lot of it has pointed out that men and women are just as bad, the point I raised is that if you want equality as a female then you should be equal on all points of human contact, etc, not just those that you want and ignore the rest. As regards being on a rampage, etc, i’m happily married with 3 kids(I just remember dating, yes it’s true, even in the olden days we had dating!). If you cannot see the fairness within this statement then you are sadly lacking.
I don’t think I have missed anything, and I certainly didn’t need any juvinile smiley’s to “emphasize” anything
(P.S. Just what exactly do you think I imagined?)
tsk tsk, now who’s putting words in other people’s mouths? haha.. ;-) guess there will always be misunderstandings & rude retaliations (when it comes to dating, asking for a first date or anything else as a matter-of-fact) simply because biased people like you exist.. sad.. :-P
now, please go back to my comment… read it.. (i take it you can read & comprehend?)
Did i ever say that girl’s are the ONLY ones taking a risk? (if you still say so, that just proves you’re a highly biased individual.. sorry!) & that automatically dissolves any of your previous arguments as well.. ;-)
Also, a guy asks a girl out ONLY after analyzing them for a long time.. they take their own cool time, & they CHOOSE the girl… the girl’s not given this additional customised time to analyze the guy & she most certainly didn’t fill an application form to be “considered” by the guy!
so, to me (once more simply an “opinion”… i have to insert this word in INVERTED COMMAS because you seem to have missed out that word entirely while reading my previous comment) it seems like you’re just some guy who’s got his feelings hurt by a girl, & is out on a rampage to get sympathy from others… that’s your right, but at least, TRY to make a fair argument ;-) Just a suggestion!
I bet you’ll be very busy omitting words from this comment & conjuring up your own interpretation.. ;-) looking forward to reading it!
(PS: you’ve got a great imagination by the way)
A man should not have to be demeaned when he asks, as some women clearly get a kick out of it,I have seen a guy ask a woman respectfully if she would like to go on a date, the attitude and absolute visiousness with which he was turned down was appaling, if it had been the other way around, the woman would have been justified in calling him all kinds of descriptions, yet when she did it, everyone is expected to take that as normal, you also say that she is the only one taking a risk(because he might be a jerk), hardly, considering that he also doesn’t know how she is going to be on a date, I don’t know what country you’re from, but if you honestly believe that a man’s feelings being hurt are acceptable because the female has no manners, then you’re an idiot and trust me its not proved anything in your country apart from the fact that the women evidently see it as their right to demean others(and thats just playing “fast” with others emotions, which is just as bad). If you want equality, then accept the good, and the bad.
Hmm, interesting article… well, these are all points that have been made before, & its always just a battle between men & women as to who’s worse & who’s better.. quite childish in itself, really.. :-P
I come from a male dominated society (specially when it comes to dating), & i dont see any harm in it… but that’s just my opinion… Guys take the risk, girls take the decision. But, a girl’s gotta live with that decision, because if a girl changes boyfriends to fast, she’s known as a “fast” girl… not a good thing in my town.. lol
so, the risk all balances out, guys risk embarassment at the hand of the girl, while girls face the risk of the guy turning out to be a complete jerk after she agrees to date him… seems fair? but, like i said before, this is my opinion, & i’m not from a western country, & this system’s proved its metal in my society all these years… so i still have faith in it.
Anyway in which you control someone is a form of dominance, the problem is that women claim that it’s only men who wish to dominate and yet turn around and say that everytime a male is successful it’s because a woman is in the background implying that she, not he is the reason for the males success, and yet fail to see the hypocrisy in their own statements, not to mention the utterly flawed reasoning. If more people were to admit that both male and female were equally as bad then perhaps there would be a greater understanding between the sexs instead of the desperate finger pointing and shallow logic displayed by both sides, however since I do not wish to die just yet I won’t be holding my breath. =)
i’m going to make this short because I have a paper on male dominance due tommorrow and I havent started on it yet, but perhaps porn stars and strippers put there bodies in a position KNOWING that they are going to get attention, male or female, they are on the stage or behind the camera for that reason. I’m thinking that its possible that they realize that before hand, but thats just me. Perhaps thats why they get there pay check. And I dont think that male dominance should be equated with phyisical abuse, its not because a male is dominant that he hits a woman, its not because a female is dominant that she hits a man. I believe its just a way to control, neither male or female dominance, just stupidity.
Anonymous, what you write is understood, but the point it that women expect (or appear to)men to change attitudes straight away and yet don’t include themselves in that expectation, also you write of male dominance and yet forget female dominated societies, lastly it still doesn’t exempt female attitudes of derogation as opposed to politely declining a proposal
The whole thing about a woman not making the first move comes from the mindset of male dominance. For all these years we have been taught that that it is not “feminine” to be aggressive. That we must wait for a man to take control. This concept was also applied to dating now; we must be submissive and wait for the men to “hunt” us. I’m not saying that it is a good way of thinking; I’m just saying that some behaviors are subconscious and hard to get rid of.
Not at all, Flipside. I found your point about Eva Braun to be very interesting. Next time someone busts out that “women behind a man” cliche, I’m going to respond with your example. That’s what these comment boxes are for. I’m glad you enjoyed the article.
Sorry to go somewhat off topic, but I just can’t resist. A number of years ago myself and some friends were discussing the state of world affairs at that time, when some of the ladies with us started going on about how the world would be run better if women were in charge and then one particuarly irritating one came out with the old “behind every great man, there’s a great woman” cliche, at this point I had, had enough of this particular “lady”, so I looked at her and said well as regards women being better in charge, what about Lucretia Borgia, that got me a blank look. Okay then how about good old Eva Braun, after all she was behind Adolf Hitler, since that day she has never spoken to me. Funny how women forget the bad female leaders, or the women who stood behind the bad men.
In regards to spousal abuse, the figures for men being attacked by their female partner is believed to be a lot higher than is known due to the fact that many of the abused males are too ashamed to admit that they are being harmed by their partner.
Artemis, as regards rape, those who commit it should be killed in my view.
Here’s a question for you. You know for a fact that women virtually always force men to make the first move and to do all the running, why do you not make the first moves for a change, or is it because women fear rejection more than men, at least men will try instead of waiting, and at least in my own circumstances on the very rare occasion that a woman does ask, I will try to let them down gently and politly, unlike many women who will snigger, sneer, deride and put down anyone in whom they are not interested. Strange how it’s alright for a woman to demean a man, but god help the man who demeans a woman, hypocrisy at it’s finest.
Tinct, I like your article, I find it interesting. I apologise for going off topic and also for making remarks to artemis in your reply column.
yours, Flipside.
You’re putting words in my mouth, Artemis; nowhere in this article do I belittle the problems of women or say that those of men outweigh those of women. In fact, I constantly recognized women’s problems specifically to avoid tired comments such as yours. So I don’t know where you’re getting this from.
The article is a response to a wildly sexist one claiming men are responsible for violent events such as school shootings and domestic abuse (which has almost nothing to do with gender except for spousal abuse); women are perfectly capable of murder just as they are of child/elder abuse.
I don’t feel like re-writing the entire article, so I can only advise you to read it in its entirety.
Also maintaining workplace’s gender balance is a protocol not an option. a common fact.
Seems like you feel that bearing the risk of rejection for dating women is more of a societal problem than women getting raped….good logic